I simply have a confusion about the destiny of Anakin Skywalker. The Jedi keep going on in the movies about how the "Chosen One," or Anakin, will destroy the Sith. All the prophecy says about the "Son of the Suns" is this:
"... And in the time of greatest despair, there shall come a savior, and he shall be known as: THE SON OF THE SUNS." —Journal of the Whills, 3:127
I see no implication that this saviour destroys the Sith. The "..." at the beginning of this clause suggests that there is more to the prophecy, however. So if the prelude to this clause that is as controversial as Revelation says anything about the Dark Side or the Force at all, the assumption of the Sith being destroyed would be justified. But if we know the prelude to this, we should include it in our Chosen One and Anakin articles.
If we do not know the prelude to this clause, and simply have to trust the words of George Lucas saying that Anakin is the Chosen One, would we also trust the words of the characters in the movie in saying that in Anakin being "Chosen," his destiny is to destroy the Sith, or bring balance to the Force?
Furthermore, Anakin, and perhaps the Chosen One, are one and the same with Sith'ari. The erection of balance supposedly completed by Skywalker was prophesized by the forces of light, yet darkness predicted that the result would be how the Sith regain their greatest foothold. With the launch of the newest book looming only hours ahead, the conversion of Jacen Solo to the Dark Side has already been revealed, and Lumiya being the current Dark Lady of the Sith. This means the Sith were not completely destroyed, and "balance" was not quite achieved.
However, the whole definition of "balance" now comes into the issue. I assume greatly that the prelude to 3:127 mentions balance because of the Jedi in the Prequel Trilogy referring to the term countless times. Does the term "balance" in this context mean the equality of light and darkness? Possibly, but that would mean consistent conflict between light and dark, none gaining the advantage, none achieving a standing absolute dominance. That seems more like the despair that the savior is supposed to save the galaxy from. To make an observation, the Legacy Era seems to be an eternal conflict with new threats and new heroes, with one war always after another. So the term "balance" that was hypothertically used in the extended prophecy does not mean peace.
A part of the prophecy that is certainly present because of the quote above, "...And in the time of greatest despair...", also implies that the reign of the Empire was a greater harbinger of despair than the Yuuzhan Vong, the Kiliks, the New Sith, and the conflict between Corellia and the Galactic Alliance. This is less definite than it should be.
When it comes to prophesy, interpretations can vary enormously, and even Star Wars has no exceptions. One of the most important aspects of Star Wars; Anakin Skywalker, is most likely the subject of one equally controversial facet, and I think ideas should be spoken to clarify this. I could be overlooking some absolutely crucial factor that focuses the image of the prophecy, the Chosen One, Anakin, the Sith, and the meaning of "balance," but for the sake of the articles on those topics, which have not helped me identify the actual destiny of Anakin, I think more thought should be put into this topic, and help us decide how to tell the Star Wars story in this encyclopedia.C3PO the Dragon Slayer
- Er... ok? Skywalka 05:41, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
Sorry for the extensive essay there. I just wanted to say everything at once, just to avoid comments from other users that point out facts I am aware of, for the purpose of efficiency.C3PO the Dragon Slayer 19:25, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
- That line from the ANH novel has never been confirmed as being the prophecy referred to in the prequels - Kwenn 19:32, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
- That could mean that they're two writings referring to the same thing or that one is referring to something else. Or the uncomfirmed possibility that I assumed beforehand that they are the same. But if that line in the "A New Hope" novelization is not something identical to what the Jedi refer to in the prequels, what is their reference?C3PO the Dragon Slayer 19:17, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
- They dont need a reference, it is because George said there is a prophecy, then there is a prophecy :) If the Sun quote is the prophecy, one would assume that official sources would keep quoting it during the PT movie promotions. They didnt quote it can almost assume to be the reason "Sun quote is not the offical Chosen One prophecy". Finally, George said Ani is the Chosen One, then he is the Chosen One: the power of G-canon, you cant argue with it. Darth Kevinmhk 03:38, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
- The closest thing we have to the actual prophecy is dialogue from the films. Mace asks Qui-Gon if he "refers to the prophecy of the one who will bring balance to the Force", implying this phrase is actually stated within the prophecy. In RotS, Obi-Wan says Anakin was "supposed to destroy the Sith, not join them! Bring balance to the Force, not leave it in darkness!", so it can be assumed that "destroy the Sith" is also stated - Kwenn 09:42, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
- George Lucas says himself that the prophecy is that Anakin will bring balance to the Force. But the Jedi may not be quoting the prophecy word for word in the prequels, though they must be pretty clear on the reference to the Sith. If Anakin's destiny was to destroy the Sith, did that bring balance to the Force? It must have, if this is G-Canon. Which we know it is. But the Emperor did not die, his spirit transfered into a clone of himself. His soul, dark and twisted as it was, did not leave the realm of "reality" until several years afterward. Does this mean that Darth Sidious was not a true Sith after Anakin Skywalker destroyed his first body?C3PO the Dragon Slayer 19:40, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
- That is a possibility. But again, people seem to be looking for a final, definitive end to evil, which would result in peace for all eternity, stemming from one person's actions. Ain't gonna happen. Anakin destroys the Sith and saves the Alliance, but the threat isn't gone. It's left to the regular, non-Chosen Ones to keep the peace - Kwenn 19:44, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
- Seems that all the bad guys want a difinitive end to good, and the good (or think they're good) guys seem to think that good could end forever. I am referring specifically to the event when Jacen Solo "saw the galaxy die." He was convinced that the Kiliks could mean the end. I have not finished Betrayal yet, so I do not know how much this played into his conversion. I know that neither side can ultimately win, but that one side can get rid of a small factor of the other side.C3PO the Dragon Slayer 22:07, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
Idk... i believe he was the choosen one mainly b/c Qui-Gon was so sure of it. Qui-Gon devoted his last words to the training of Anakin. Also, in the destruction of the sith Anakin did bring balance to the force, albeit temporarily. The prophecy said nothing of the balance to be eternal. did it?
We do not know exactly what the prophecy says specifically. All that we can be sure of is that Anakin brings balance to the Force, and possibly bringing about the destruction of the Sith. I thought the destruction of the Sith would be permanent, and all the latter Sith lords and ladies, like Lumiya, are a bunch of unofficial wanna-be's. I could be wrong, though I do have a slight annoyance at the media for only making Force-sensitive darksiders the villians. There are people and aliens that are evil that don't have to be able to use Force-lightning.
Anyway, it is a possibility that Anakin was Chosen because Qui-Gon chose him, but did the choice make him inevitably destined to "bring balance to the Force?" If Anakin had not turned to the Dark Side, what would have happened? Likely, he would have ended the Clone Wars, and he would have exposed Palpatine. Presumably, if all events were the same up to this point, but he chose the end of the Sith over the possible saving of his wife, Palpatine would have died, and Anakin's career could have continued as a warrior fighting for the Republic. Then it would be possible that when the Yuuzhan Vong would strike after the weakening of the government resulting from the loss of the Chancellor, and the weakening of the military after the intense Clone Wars, then Anakin would probably liberate the galaxy from that threat. But, the Senate could turn on the Jedi, and the "hundreds of Senators under the influence of Darth Sidious" would order the discontinuation of the Jedi, even if it did not take the form of Order 66. Would this be a balance of the Force? If Anakin had not turned on the Jedi, could balance be achieved? Maybe not. If that is the case, of which we can not know, it would mean that Anakin's conversion was just as predestined as his acts as a savior ultimately.C3PO the Dragon Slayer 16:30, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
- But the point of destiny is that Anakin was always going to turn to the dark side, because it leads him to that place in that time when he can fulfil the prophecy. And as to the media using only dark siders as villains....what about the Yuuzhan Vong? Not to mention various other threats - Thrawn, Daala, Thrackan Sal-Solo, Grievous.... - Kwenn 17:18, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
- I quote the wise little green Yoda in saying "Always in motion, the future is." I take this to mean that George Lucas believes that the Star Wars universe is not dictated by predestiny, but also by a person's choices. The future can be influenced by a great many things, and I seriously doubt that Anakin had no alternative to becoming a Sith in the paths of time. But for the prophecy to have come true, you say, he has to turn to the Dark Side first. But prophecies seem to usually be right. (I can think of several happenstances when that seems to be wrong.) This means that whatever the Chosen One's path, he would bring balance to the Force, because whichever way time goes, the Chosen One will eventually save the day until his death. (Sorry if you misunderstand my wording.) I agree that there were many threats to the peace before and after the Battle of Yavin, but many, if not most, were associated in some way with the Dark Jedi or the Sith. I wish to discontinue the part about darksiders being the only villians, but if you wish to persist, Kwenn, you may start another forum, but I think there are better things to do on this site than to spread disagreements. (As for this forum, I think of it as settling a controversy.)C3PO the Dragon Slayer 19:46, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
- I thought (perhaps eroneously) that the prophecy said that the Chosen One would bring balance to the Force, and Yoda misinterpereted this to mean he would destroy the Sith. Jolee explains in KotOR how evil and good come and go in waves and one is never completely eradicated.)--This isn't related to the topic, but I'm new. I see everyone has user pages. Is there a special way to make those, or do I just write my own using the redlink?CaptainPellaeon1138 3 June 2006
- It is very possible that the destruction of the Sith interpretation was "the misread" part. In other words, the Prophecy says nothing about the Sith. We know for certain that the Prophecy says that the Chosen One brings balance to the Force and the Chosen One is Anakin. But was the act of throwing Palpatine off a cliff the thing that make Anakin "Chosen?" Possibly not. I think it was the redemption in itself that brought the Light Side back into dominance. If Skywalker Senior had not had the emotions of his love for what was left of his old life, his son he knew so barely, and his acknowledgement that he was fatally injured and probably could not make it much further in life, he would not have done all he could do to stop the hatred he hated, the fear he feared, and the pain he suffered for. That was the will of the Force, was it not?
I like the proposition that it was Qui-Gon who "Chose" Anakin. Had Obi-Wan not chose Tatooine for their refuge, they would not have encountered the slave, and Anakin would have had a very different path. But the prophecy may have chosen somebody else if those exact sequences had not taken place. The beauty of foresight is that there is no limitation to time or place, no restriction to what or who, so eventually, whatever God or luck or the Force decides to do with the universe, in all likelihood it would be fulfilled.
As for the creation of a user page, you can do so simply by using the redlink.C3PO the Dragon Slayer 21:20, 4 June 2006 (UTC)