Article milestones Date Process Result December 16, 2010 Featured article candidate Failure December 24, 2010 Failed featured article candidate
Current status: Failed featured article candidate

Contents 1 Clone 2 Canonicity? 3 Picture 4 Distant Thunder 5 Cloaking Device or Force Cloak? 6 Force Unleashed III? 7 Picture

CloneEdit

Has anyone considered that the dead "Galen Marek" shown to the Dark apprentice might have been just a dead clone Vader had set up. I only suggest this because if it was a clone, then Starkiller may be the real Marek . . . but the dark clone is clearly a clone but then . . . . Look i really think the clone storyline was taken too far.--Ironreaper 09:08, October 31, 2010 (UTC)

Also many are claiming that this clone is real because the endings to not affect what became before. How do you know this? Have you a source that the dark clone was there at the Light ending hiding (thats some great work dark clone, letting your master be arrested). How do we not know that in the canon stroyline (aka the light ending) the dark apprentice also refused to be turned and was killed. I consider the fact that Starkiller refused to kill Vader as proof that he will never fall. He proved himself above the dark side, so the clone too did not submit. In the dark ending, Starkiller proves he is willing to fall to the dark side, thus validating the dark apprentice as following a path Starkiller very much could have. He is mostly symbolic, not literal. unless a reliable sorce contents he was hiding during the light ending, then he is not canon for me.--Ironreaper 09:08, October 31, 2010 (UTC)

• I did wonder if the dead body was actually a clone as well, but there is nothing in the story that implies or confirms it not to be the "real deal" so wondering about it is just speculating and we all know how Wookieepedia feels about that. All we have is what we got from the games regarding the original Starkiller's fate. At the end of the first game, Vader, Palpatine and even Kota confirmed that Marek was well and truly dead - one with the Force. In the second game, Starkiller is affected by the memories of the template, just like all of the other clones. With the exception of the "essence transfer" ability, it is stated in the novel that cloning is not the same thing as the "resurrection" of a dead person since clones are their own individuals (similar in many ways, but ultimately separate from the original). I do agree that the whole clone storyline was taken too far, and was far too vague! They should have just revealed it at the end rather than leave us with a cliffhanger that may never be answered if TFU III isn't made! JRT2010 09:58, October 31, 2010 (UTC)JRT2010

• It's unlikely that the Dark Apprentice's development and actions are directly tied in with the player character. There is nothing to indicate that just because Sarkiller resisted the Dark Side, then the Dark Apprentice would as well. It was only confirmed that the Dark Side ending was non-canon, but there is no indication that the Distant Thunder cinematics are non-canon as well. These scenes, and even the events recorded on the lead cloning technician's log on the dark clone's Databank profile, can confirm the Dark Apprentice's existence in Star Wars canon. As for why he didn't attack in the light side ending, Vader told him not to interfere unless he was needed (like about Vader about to die). To assume anything beyond that would be speculation. Ultimately, it's all very vague but that was obviously intentional. Unless it' confirmed that Starkiller is not a clone, we can only rely on Vader's word and the existence of other clones that shared the same burdensome memories as the player character. Unless it is confirmed that the Dark Apprentice is non-canon, the Distant Thunder scenes are evidence of his canonical existence since they take place before the ending. The game's story remains the same up to the point where you can choose between two different endings. JRT2010 09:58, October 31, 2010 (UTC)JRT2010
  • Just to add on why Starkiller's decision to resist the dark side doesn't likely affect the Dark Apprentice's path: Ni-Ke-Vanz affirmed that clones were different versions of the same templates, which means they're not only different in some ways from the original, but from each other as well. This is also backed up by the fact that the clones of Jango Fett naturally had many similarities, but more than a few characteristic differences as well. Also, Starkiller followed Marek's path because he couldn't distinguish his template's memories as separate from his own experience, and so he was essentially controlled by them. Not only did the Dark Apprentice able to do this, he showed pride in doing so, as well as hate and disgust for his original self's failings. The point is that even though they are both clones of the same person, they're not bound to do the same things or behave in the exact same way since Star Wars has already shown how clones from the same template have different characteristic traits to their personality. JRT2010 10:18, October 31, 2010 (UTC)JRT2010

Canonicity? Edit

Would someone please explain to me how his appearence in the comic is canon, when he never appears in the game except in the non-canon dark side ending? Rac Ward

• Because they take place before the ending of the game. The light and dark side endings only affect the outcome of the game, not what came before. It's not two alternate timelines, one light the other dark. Everything in the story proceeds as it does until the player character reaches the end where he choose between two paths. Taking that into consideration, there is no confirmation that the Distant Thunder cinematics are non-canon. JRT2010 11:30, November 2, 2010 (UTC)JRT2010
• I love how everyone seems to disregard the dark apprentice as "non-canon" simply because he didn't kill Starkiller in the light side ending. He was still there, but he just didn't attack for whatever reason. Darth Tyranitar 19:10, November 6, 2010 (UTC)

Yes, he and several Terror troopers are there, watching . . . for several hours as their master is imprisoned. Explain to me then why he didn't just attack then? What reason is it? Even if he was suppose to wait so he could follow them to the rebel base, then why didnt he attack when he heard from Juno that it was on Dantooine?--Ironreaper 02:42, November 22, 2010 (UTC)

• Even if that was a rhetorical question, it seems redundant to keep asking it when it's been answered several times by now. The evidence is the Distant Thunder cinematics, the lead cloning technician's entry logs (recorded in the Dark Apprentice's Databank profile), and the fact that Starkiller (the other clone) saw a vision of how he would die if he tried to strike down Darth Vader. He saw that his killer was the Dark Apprentice (the reborn Starkiller). The fact that the Dark Apprentice was in the novel, albeit seen through a Force vision, practically proves that he was created just like the player character in the canon storyline. If the Dark Apprentice did not exist in canon, then Starkiller wouldn't have had a vision of him and he would have been free to strike down Vader without getting stabbed in the chest. As for why he didn't save Vader for getting arrested, that's an explanation that only the game's creators can provide. Until then, we go with what we're given and they indicate that the Dark Apprentice is canon. JRT2010 15:52, November 22, 2010 (UTC)JRT2010

I just realized that there's yet another source that backs up all of the evidence that indicates his canon status. While some doubt the Dark Apprentice's canonicty, no one argues that the Aberrant Clones are non-canon, for obvious reasons. In their Databank Profile, the Lead Cloning Technician details their progress (or lack thereof) in a series of Log Entries. In Enrty 50 he says that a single test subject showed "remarkable stability and progress." At first, I thought he was talking about the player character (before he went rogue). But in the Dark Apprentice's Databank Profile, the same Technician's Entry Logs are listed, starting with Entry 51 which practically describes the Dark Apprentice as the only perfect clone. Obviously the "single test subject" in Entry 50 is the Dark Apprentice, who's unique development is detailed in Entry 51. The fact that he is mentioned in a source about the Aberrant Clones (whose canonicity is not in question) virtually proves that the Dark Apprentice is a canon-based character, or at the very least simply adds more evidence to it. JRT2010 07:11, November 25, 2010 (UTC)JRT2010

And as to why he didn't stop them from taking Vader? Trechery is the way of the Sith, after all. For all we know he was on the Slave 1 with Boba Fett after the Rebels dropped a Star Destroyer on the complex. 173.180.89.129 06:35, January 8, 2011 (UTC)

• It's possible, but not really likely. No doubt Vader would've given the Dark Apprentice his own ship, as he did with Starkiller, so the Dark Apprentice wouldn't need to use Slave I. Plus, there is no indication that he's on the ship in the TFU II comic book, which follows Boba Fett's story in the game. Based on that book, Boba didn't seem to even be aware that there was a Dark Apprentice. Admittedly, there no indication that the Dark Apprentice is not on Slave I, but there's also no indication that he is. -General Quilix 21:05, April 26, 2011 (UTC)

I am really confused by this characters canonicity. In the Starkiller (clone) section it is stated that the Dark Side ending is non-canon yet this character is stated as canon through two sources through the vision in the novel and through Distant Thunder. Now while the novel states this was a possibility if the clone of Marek chose to act this way that this would be the result but how does the Distant Thunder cinematic establish the characters canonicity? Alot of what I have been reading through the conversation has been either that the Distant Thunder cinematic would be like a what if situation? During the Dark Side ending of the Force Unleashed 2 a few things happen that establish that Starkiller's light side ending is the canon ending. For example in the Dark Side Ending of Force Unleashed 2, Rahm Kota was pushed off the landing platform by the Dark Apprentice and thus can be reasoned that this ended the General's life. Now suppose this was the canon ending how is it that Rahm Kota appears Elite Squadron perfectly fine except for his blindness? Also the recent Downloadable Content for the game where the Dark Apprentice leads and assault on Endor and kills Leia also establishes this characters non-canon status. Given this is also the same in the original game where the player could choose a dark side ending that was established as non-canon. The only canon appearence of Marek's dark side self was in a vision he recieved in the Jedi Temple. This non-canon appearence was further explored in the Ultimate Sith Edition of the Force Unleashed. It seems to me that the parallel between these two characters should be the template in establishing whether the Dark Apprentice appearence was only as a vision or a what if situation and not as a canon character. While it has been established that Starkiller is a clone and that he fought other incomplete clones no other completed clone is known. There are too many conflicting elements of both the Starkiller (clone) article and this one. This must be addressed quickly. Based on also what I have seen alot of what happens to this character and regarding his assumed fate shouldn't be used as a basis for establishing the characters canonicity. Rac Ward

• It has already pointed out for those in doubt that the non-canon dark side ending is simply an alternate option on what would have happened if Starkiller chose to kill Vader; it does not affect what occurred before that point in the story where Starkiller has to make a choice. The Distant Thunder cinematics occurred before the ending, and therefore is part of the canon storyline. The Dark Apprentice's appearance in the novel makes him canon because Starkiller saw him in a vision of the future, a future that was likely to happen because when Juno was captured, Starkiller contemplated about killing everyone who stood in his way (presumably Vader as well) and was thus falling back to the dark side, which then caused him to see a vision of the Dark Apprentice in his future (not some Force manifestation of what he could become). The other evidence is the fact that the Dark Apprentice's development is detailed not only in his Databank profile, but also in the Aberrant Clones' profile as well (from the cloning technician's entry logs, starting with Entry 50 in the aberrant clones' profile and continuing on to Enrty 51 in the Dark Apprentice's profile). Starkiller's option to kill Vader does not magically snap the Dark Apprentice into existence. The story follows one timeline (not two) up until the ending where you have the canon ending and non-canon ending. JRT2010 09:08, January 8, 2011 (UTC)

Picture Edit

The image in the infobox should be changed to something that shows him better. There is a part in the game where he removes his hood, looks pretty cool and is fairly clear. I have it on xbox so I can't take a screenshot, but if somebody else could get this and change it that'd be great. The current one isn't too great for an infobox image. Darth Tyranitar 19:15, November 6, 2010 (UTC)

• The image is also from the Dark Side Ending, making the image itself non-canon. And the image where he removes his hood is also non-canon, so we should get one from Distant Thunder.
• The infobox picture is only meant to show what he looks like. Yeah, that picture shows a "dark side ending" moment, but nevertheless his appearance is still the same in the canon storyline, as seen in the last Distant Thunder cinematic and the Dark Apprentice's Databank profile. I think we can make an exception for the current image, if only to show what he looks like and because that image has better quality than the Distant Thunder stuff. JRT2010 23:25, November 25, 2010 (UTC)JRT2010
  • I used the "Yeah, that picture shows a 'dark side ending' moment, but nevertheless his appearance is still the same in the canon storyline, as seen in the last Distant Thunder cinematic" arguement with Grand Moff Tranner in relation to the DA's eye colour (in the last scene of Distant Thunder we see a tiny sliver of his left eye and it looks red; in the Dark Side ending and Endor DLC his eyes look yellow) and I still got shot down. And about keeping that image, JRT2010... that's a no-go: Tranner says he's going to replace the current image with one from the Distant Thunder cutscene (despite the fact that none of the images from Distant Thunder show him in as much detail or give a verifiable look at his Sith eyes as the non-canon ending does) because it was decided that no information pertaining to the non-canon ending should be included in the info-box because it is non-canon, quality be d*mned. I tried to argue against it, but I had no such luck. 173.180.89.129 11:33, January 11, 2011 (UTC)
    • This has nothing to do with quality. Non-canon information is never included in an infobox on a canon topic. This is established site policy, and common sense. Furthermore, this talk page is not a forum for you to complain about an administrator just because you happen to disagree with him; if any such conversations continue, I will distribute formal warnings as necessary. Grand Moff Tranner ^(Comlink) 20:47, January 11, 2011 (UTC)
• But the Dark Apprentice is canon, and his appearance is the same regardless of whether he actually reveals himself on Kamino. Seems a little odd to replace a quality image with a lesser-quality image just because of an insignificant technicality 95.149.213.93 19:04, February 12, 2011 (UTC)

Distant Thunder Edit

This might be a stupid question on my part, but where is it confirmed (or even really implied) that the clone of Marek in "Distant Thunder" is the Dark Apprentice and not the version of Starkiller that you actually play as in the game? Rikoshi 23:38, November 12, 2010 (UTC)

UM have you not watched the alternate ending. The dark apprentice wears the same stuff and could strike down a juno hologram in the distant thunder cinematics. That is something that the starkiller we play as could not do. I think that proves it without it being confirmed.--SUP3RCHUBBY 17:24, November 13, 2010 (UTC)

Cloaking Device or Force Cloak? Edit

I'm just curious because some articles pertaining to the character and the dark side ending say it was a cloaking device, and others say he was using Force cloaking. Either way the discrepency should be fixed. 173.180.89.129 11:15, January 11, 2011 (UTC)

• TFUII limited collector's edition (PS3/PC/360) included a flash drive with some concept art and behind-the-scenes stuff. One of these was a draft of TFUII's game script. The game script covers the non-canon ending as well as the original. Without looking up the exact wording, the script described the Dark Apprentice as having the same cloaking device as the Terror Troopers. However, the script also describes the DA removing his helmet, instead of his hood, and another source (Concept art or Databank), indicates that the Terror Troopers don't cloak at all, but simply move really fast. SinisterSamurai 03:42, April 7, 2011 (UTC)

Force Unleashed III? Edit

I'm a little confused here. If the Dark Apprentice didn't even appear in light side ending of The Force Unleashed II, but since he appeared in the novel, does that mean that he will appear for a eventual canon confrontation between himself and the good Starkiller in the sequel? Lord KOT 01:35, November 27, 2010 (UTC)

• That's pretty much what is being speculated thus far. His appearance in Distant Thunder, the novel, the Databank profile of the Aberrant Clones, as well as his own profile all but confirm him as a canon character, even though he did not show himself at the end in the light side ending. There's also this thing online about a "Force Unleashed II DLC" which is probably like the "Ultimate Sith Edition" and it's said to follow the dark side ending of TFU II. Beyond all of that, your guess is as good as mine when it comes to what's going to happen in TFU III.
  • Really? When will that be out? What does DLC stand for? Lord KOT 02:59, November 27, 2010 (UTC)
    • DLC stands for "Downloadable Content." I'm not sure when it's going to be released, but some sources said sometime this year, or possibly 2011. If you google "Force Unleashed II DLC", you can find some sources like this one (http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/113/1134890p1.html). Some pictures show the Dark Apprentice on Endor, but in a new outfit which *kind of* resembles the Sith Stalker Armor (minus prothetics and other cybernetic attachments). JRT2010 03:43, November 27, 2010 (UTC)JRT2010

Picture Edit

I know that the origanal picture of the dark apprentice is non canon but in the novel doesant starkiller have a vision of the dark side ending. So like kamlins picture cant we put it in and say below as seen in starkillers vision.

Posted by darth bobo 6.posted 7.28 pm

• It doesn't work that way. Non-canon is non-canon. Grand Moff Tranner ^(Comlink) 10:59, April 6, 2011 (UTC)