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This is the talk page for the article "Echani."

This space is used for discussion relating to changes to the article, not for a discussion about the topic in question. Please remember to stay civil and sign all of your comments with four tildes (~~~~). Click here to start a new topic.

OriginsEdit

I think the article should mention something about the origins of Echani, if known of course MoffRebus 01:05, 29 Dec 2005 (UTC)

Well, among other users, there's the Royal Guard from the Hand of Thrawn Duology, can't recall his name. LightWarden 01:42, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

Also, shouldn't we talk about the martial art as well as the people?

Grodin Tierce is the Royal Guard from the Hand of Thrawn books, it's a complex situation though as to who / what everything was about him.

As someone who wrote about the Echani when they were just a name for equipment (KOTOR 1) I decided then to create the species. If you read the works where I did (Fan fiction, Genesis of a Jedi and Return From Exile) I tried for a rich society that is linked to combat on the level of a religion. Over at Lucasforums Coruscant Entertainment Center, under the name Machievelli, I created their society 25,000 years ago. All long before this page ever existed.

I named their planet (And Goddess they worship) Echana, and made their training in all forms of unarmed and bladed combat part of their religion, and expanded the idea of 'conflict equals communication' far beyond the words in this article. If the moderators would like to see that work, or use that work to fill this out, please let me know.24.234.227.16 02:42, December 8, 2013 (UTC)

4.3 Added quote Edit

I think this article would benifit greatly from more pictures

Echani poem Edit

Where's that from? -- I need a name (Complain here) 16:00, 1 February 2007 (UTC) Knights of the Old Republic 2: The Sith Lords. Quoted by Brianna in the bonus talking options.Kevinsanya 06:19, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

BTSEdit

  • Talks about them all having white hair, which if you go to Manaan in KotOR I, is simply not true. Atarumaster88 Jedi Order (Audience Chamber) 01:27, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
    • They weren't going to make an entire new model just for a NPC that only says a few setences, and unrelated to the plot. Blacktiger9000 20:55, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
      • Unless you work for the developers, said information is irrelevant, as a dark-haired Echani is still canon. Atarumaster88 Jedi Order (Talk page) 20:57, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
        • Is it also canon that 25% of the people in the Galaxy looked exactly like that Echani? Or that transformation into a Rakghoul was instant? Blacktiger9000 21:25, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
          • Of course not. These are only game mechanics (I suppose you meant that). We are facing the same issue here like with the Sith and the Mandalorians - there was a race, it had a culture, which strongly influenced members of other races - so strongly that extraspecific members of the culture were also called like the members of the species, because their behaviour/philosophy/social-historical impact etc. was essentially the same. There are 2 possibilities for the guy in KOTOR1:

1. He is Echani by species, and then not all of them have silver hair (in this case it is original research).

2. He is not Echani by species (then he is Human) but he lives and fights like an Echani (just as Human 'Mandalorians' live and fight like a Mandalorian, or as Human Dark Jedi accustomed to the traditions of the Sith species and started to be addressed Sith Lords). Domlith 16:13, 25 October 2007 (UTC) Where is it stated that Echani is a species? Perhaps it is a group, at least during the time of KotOR onwards. This would support how other Echani look different from the handmaidens. In fact the handmaidens' looks themselves could be attributed to their father solely. Kevinsanya 06:22, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Chris Avellone's post, 3 Dec 2004 Edit

/ Begin Echani rambling:

The "Echani" were mentioned in Kotor1, and they are also the people responsible for the fighting styles used by Palpatine's Imperial Guard (at least as it's explained in the Expanded Universe, most notably in Crimson Empire, I believe). The Echani rely heavily on hand-to-hand combat and personal shield technology, and they had their asses handed to them by Revan during the Jedi Civil War, because, not surprisingly, there weren't many people able to face Revan across a battlefield and survive the encounter.

With little to go on for K2, we decided to expand the culture with those elements in mind, and even have a member of the Echani be able to join your party - which is responsible for much of the new hand-to-hand fighting feats and animations you'll see in the game, as well as potentially new powers.

Echani are a culture that communicates through battle, and there are many fighting rituals they use when dealing with their own people - and perhaps your character as well. If you wish to gain influence with them, engaging them in sparring matches or combat can earn their respect, their trust, and perhaps more.

The greatest among the Echani are said to be able to read their opponent's moves so well they can predict the path of a battle several seconds, sometimes even minutes in advance, by gauging their opponent's fighting style, heart rate, and their movements in combat. In many ways, the Echani see combat as a rapid dejarik game, calculating feints, attacks, and dodges with a speed that few can surpass.

More on the Echani will be present in the game, but I wanted to talk a little about their origins and their current ties to the Expanded Universe.

/ End Echani Ramblings.

[1] - Sikon 13:21, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Home World? Edit

What world did they come from?--Darth Scott 22:03, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

I was asking because it wasn't mentioned in the article.--Darth Scott 07:20, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Brianna Edit

I don't think Brianna's image is entirely suitable for the infobox, considering that she is only a halfblood. --Kessel 21:03, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Species?Edit

  • I'm curious. I've read every source I could find on the Echani, from Crimson Empire to Kotor to the sourcebooks but I can't find a single line saying they're a seperate near-human species. Where does it say that?SarimThiri 07:01, 23 November 2008 (UTC)
    • Is there any source at all supporting this claim? I've seen that source? tag there now for two weeks, and noone seems to have come up with any. Shouldn't that claim be removed?Gratulor - User Page 18:01, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

All gone? Edit

All references to the echani, especially the Sun Guard speak of them in past tense, as if they no longer exist. Where and when has this been confirmed? Are there no more echani by the time of the Galactic Empire and NEw Republic? -Unsigned comment by 161.243.118.99 (talk • contribs).

  • All in-universe content is in past tense on the wiki, because it's "a long time ago, in a galaxy far far away." Imperial and New Republic era content is also past tense. -LtNOWIS 21:12, 26 November 2008 (UTC)
  • Does that mean the Echani are still around in the time of the Galactic Empire and beyond? Or are you just trying to be cute? I'm not asking that sarcastically, i'm just genuinely trying to get a serious answer here.Unsigned comment by 161.243.118.99 (talk • contribs).
    • I haven't noticed anything about the Echani living in the times after the Rise of the Empire. The only thing I remember about anything related to them being the martial arts used by the Emperor's Royal Guard. Darth Batrus 21:49, 26 November 2008 (UTC)
    • Wookieepedia:Manual of Style requires all articles to be in past tense, even when describing subjects which may still have existed well beyond the latest documented point in the Expanded Universe timeline. So, no, this article shouldn't be taken to imply that the Echani are known to have gone extinct. We can say that they existed as late as Raskta Lsu's time, and that their martial arts forms were in use as late as the Imperial period. —Silly Dan (talk) 03:26, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
    • Part of my confusion here stems from the entries on Thyrssus and the Sun Guards. The Thyrsus entry says they preserved the Echani culture, which would seem to imply the Echani themselves were no longer around to do their own cultural preservation. However the SunGuard entry says the Echani martial arts are just a more brutal and effective version of the Sun Guard's style, which implies Thyrsus and the Sun Guard predate the Echani.
Well nothing indicates if the the Echani are still alive or not. We only know their traditions survive at minimum, at least by the time of the Empire. Its concievable that they might have survived but as far as I know, nothing seems to indicate that they are active in the latter eras. Darth Batrus 18:15, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Oh well thanks for the additional information all. If anybody ever does get a definite answer I'd apprecciate if you throw in an appropriate update on the entry
  • I remember an old picture of a female Echani in Star Wars: The Clone Wars style, when the series was still in early production. But I don´t know if that picture was of a later abandoned character, flase information, due to production politics or unrelated and just inspired by Star Wars: The Clone Wars.
  • This is just a theory but if we follow the parallels of the Echani and the Mandalorians then we might assume that the Echani are also spread out. So much so that perhaps it is general knowledge that they were thought extinct in the galaxy. Like how the Mandalorians were once thought extinct. We could also follow the parallels of the Echani craft being of the assassin varity; leading to thoughts of them being secretive and such.

Since we really don't have much information on them it is hard to create an accurate answer without original research and/or conjecture. Let's hope they are covered in more depth in the MMORPG TOR.Kevinsanya 05:28, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Eshan Edit

Where's the Information about this "Eshan" being their homeworld from? I haven't read about it anywhere, is there any information or sourcing to verify this?--Kahn Iceay 06:33, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Home World, not Echani Confederation Edit

From what I've found online, WotC lists the Echani having an "Echani Confederation" I however doubt this is their homeworld as sources say the CSWE has the Echani originating from Eshan.--Kahn Iceay 23:26, October 12, 2009 (UTC)

  • I went to the local Barnes and Nobel to check a copy of the CSWE and Essential Atlas, Eshan is indeed canon and exists in the Inner Rim. Regarding this, I'll edit the page to have Eshan as the homeworld.--Kahn Iceay 22:53, October 13, 2009 (UTC)

And now to add even more confusion to all this a new Echani System has been released to the online companion here. So is Eshan in the Echani System? Is the Echani System another system all together that is under the Six Sisters/Echani Command flag? Will there every be anything canon about it? These questions and more will likely go unanswered next update of the Atlas. Same Bat Time. Same Bat URL.--Kahn Iceay 17:44, November 27, 2009 (UTC)

Rivals? Edit

The article mentions that the Echani are rivals to the Mandalorians, but shouldn't it also mention how they are rivals with the Iridonians? --Bron Hañda 01:47, February 8, 2010 (UTC)

While I think its safe to assume thats true is it ever stated specifically in KotOR? I know there was some mentioning of the rivalry between the Mando's and the Iridonians but in the KotOR games was there specific mentioning of the Echani having the same sort of Rivalry? --Kahn Iceay 01:59, February 19, 2010 (UTC)

They aren't a different species Edit

They're a group of humans with white hair. Just like there are groups of humans with black skin, red hair etc. A species is defined as group that can interbreed and produce fertile offspring. If they were a different species they couldn't do that, and brianna wouldn't exist.--178.167.179.105 22:54, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

  • "Master Raskta Lsu, an Echani, sat at the controls of her ship. She had the alabaster skin, pure white hair, and silver eyes common to all her species." - from Darth Bane: Rule of Two. - Lord Hydronium 03:07, July 7, 2010 (UTC)
It doesn't matter what that says, it doesn't change the biological defitinion of a species. He obviously was using "species" to mean "population", which sounds a bit too technical.--178.167.151.237 13:34, July 7, 2010 (UTC)
If they can then they are all one species. That's hte biological definition. And I doubt some of them listed on that page could.--178.167.151.237 13:34, July 7, 2010 (UTC)
"unique lifeforms" is extremely subjective...what is the definition of an SW species?--92.251.236.7 16:06, July 7, 2010 (UTC)
The definition happens to be whatever the world of god happens to state it is. As mentioned above Darth Bane: Rule of Two specifically states that the Echani are of their own species. Therefore they are a different species. No amount of speculation and outside definitions and sources will alter that. --Kahn Iceay 01:48, July 10, 2010 (UTC)
  • "The Ultimate Alien Anthology" source book does not mention Echani as a distinct species. I've never had the impression that Echani was a species (instead of a culture) in Kotor I as well. Is that one line from a Darth bane novel really the only source that calls Echani a species? I think that would quality as a mistake on the author's part.
KotOR, KotOR II, and Darth Bane: Rule of Two all came out after Ultimate Alien Anthology. You'll notice Ultimate Alien Anthology doesn't mention the Selkath, or those armored aliens called Iridonians, or the species of the planet Utapau all of which were featured in media that came out after UAA. Pointing out a book that came out before a species first appeared as a reference point doesn't help your argument. As it stands the Echani have been pointed out as a separate Near-Human species in canon, so thats what they are till something of higher canon overwrites it.--Kahn Iceay 23:57, September 7, 2010 (UTC)

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