Talk:Galactic Emperor
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Thrawn never proclaimed himself Emperor, nor sought such a title. --SparqMan 01:29, 31 Jul 2005 (UTC)
- "I rule the Empire now. Not some long dead Emperor; certainly not you." Thrawn, to Mara Jade, in Dark Force Rising, Page 279. I said it was leaders of the Empire proper.
- The list certainly says "List of Emperors". I think the statement was a way of Thrawn showing Mara Jade that she held no sway over him, not that he was the leader of the Empire proper. The same goes for Ysanne Isard, unless she claims it later in the X-wing books (I'm just getting back to those now). --SparqMan 16:48, 1 Aug 2005 (UTC)
- Unless I see information that he was reporting to Palpatine on Byss, I believe Thrawn was Leader of the Empire, and should be treated as such. We could put an Asterisk by his name, syaing Thrawn never styled himself Emperor. --User:SFH
- IIRC, Essential Chronology indicates that he acted with the consent and support of the Council of Moffs, and that Palpatine had already begun to call forces to himself Thrawn's campaign. He allowed Thrawn to serve as a distraction and limited his forces (both to rebuild his own and with the knowledge that Thrawn would thrive under the constraint). --SparqMan 17:48, 1 Aug 2005 (UTC)
- Unless I see information that he was reporting to Palpatine on Byss, I believe Thrawn was Leader of the Empire, and should be treated as such. We could put an Asterisk by his name, syaing Thrawn never styled himself Emperor. --User:SFH
- The list certainly says "List of Emperors". I think the statement was a way of Thrawn showing Mara Jade that she held no sway over him, not that he was the leader of the Empire proper. The same goes for Ysanne Isard, unless she claims it later in the X-wing books (I'm just getting back to those now). --SparqMan 16:48, 1 Aug 2005 (UTC)
Now that I look at this list again, much of it could be used to describe those who desired the true prestige and power of the full throne, but never held it. Troculus, Kadann, Carnor Jax, and Xandel Carivus may have proclaimed themselves Emperor, but never held the power that Palpatine, his legal "heir" Pestage" or the defacto ruler Isard held. Plenty of other would-be-Emperor's held a good deal of influence, power and ego. It would be quite a list to include them all. --SparqMan 17:53, 1 Aug 2005 (UTC)
- I vote we leave it as is. Thanos6 16:42, 2 Aug 2005 (UTC)
- Inaccuracy is not the name of the game here. --SparqMan 17:54, 2 Aug 2005 (UTC)
- Trioculus, Kadann, Jax, and Carivus all had legitimate grounds to proclaim themselves Emperor (T was acting with the support of the surviving moffs, K had drawn off much of Isard's support, and J and C were the heads of the Imperial Ruling Council that formed after Palpatine died on Onderon).Thanos6 18:26, 2 Aug 2005 (UTC)
- Inaccuracy is not the name of the game here. --SparqMan 17:54, 2 Aug 2005 (UTC)
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[edit] Let's get some agreement
- Ok, to start with. Can we accept that the following were at least "defacto" Emperors: Palpatine, Sate Pestage and Isard? That should be a start. Then we can try to sort out which of the pretenders might also qualify. QuentinGeorge 06:05, 3 Aug 2005 (UTC)
- Palpatine and Sate Pestage were Emperors. Isard could be argued as a de facto Emperor, although with so many warlords operating independently at the time, I'm not sure she ranks any higher than other powerful leaders, despite her strong control of many Imperial functions. --SparqMan 21:59, 7 Aug 2005 (UTC)
- Perhaps we should split off the stuff on what happened to Imperial power after Endor into another article, and redefine this one to discuss the office of Emperor (as distinct from Palpatine the man); that in itself could be a useful project to assemble what is known rather than constitutional-fantasy fanon? --McEwok 15:41, 14 Aug 2005 (UTC)
- I know people are gonna get upset when I point this out, but there is no denying it. Isard never styled herself as Empress. The only title she used was Director of Imperial Intelligence. User:SFH
- Upset? Nope - entirely happy. Pestage is described, IIRC, as "interim Emperor", which falls a step shot; the Tribunal are the Tribunal; Isard is Director of Intelligence; the GoDV stuff, I'm not sure about; Thrawn is simply a Grand Admiral, latterly Supreme Commander; and Carnor Jax is described as "posturing as the new Dark Lord"... moreover, only Crimson Empire occurs after the death of the last Palpatine clones, rendering any previous claimants FACPOV usurpers. Beyond this, Palpatine was proclamed by the Senate, but the Senate is suspended, and was never recalled, so constitutionally, not even the farce in CEII is legitimate - thiugh I suppose, that could explain the play with Ederlath Pallopides, since the NR has laid claim to Senatorial legitimacy. -- McEwok 02:54, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)
- I guess I'm just a bit of an alarmist. But as to your request to seperate the Galactic Emperor from Emperor Palpatine, I don't know if that is possible. So much of it was wraped up in Palpatine. The Empire was designed to not function without him. User:SFH
- Oh, I agree; all I meant was that there should be room on Wiki for two articles, one basically a biography of Palpatine, and one a more constitutional survey of the origins and development of the office. If I have time, I might write something on successon after Endor, too: "It is unclear in retrospect what the exact constitutional position the Galactic Empire found itself in after the Battle of Endor was; and it may be that the Empire's leaders had no more idea than this at the time, either...." --McEwok 03:14, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Title and Powers
Should we, perhaps, make a distinction the article concerning those people who called themselves emperor/empress and those who simply held the powers of the post (i.e. de facto emperor/empress)? For instance, there is no evidence that states that Isard held the title of Galactic Empress, yet we know she wielded such powers and, according to The New Essential Chronology "Isard was secretly pitting each side against the other so she could rise from their ashes and rule as Empress." (132). Now, it states she wants to rule as empress, but as far as I understand, she still held the title of Director (of Imperial Intelligence) once she took the reigns of power of the Empire... She was de facto Galactic Empress, but does this actually make her that post?--SOCL 00:47, 27 Oct 2005 (UTC)
- NEC states that both Isard and Pestage "held the throne" so I think they're unquestionably emperor/empress. Kuralyov 05:40, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
[edit] The Tribunal and Sarcev Quest
Going by the material in Imperial Ruling Council, should we add the three member Tribunal and Sarcev Quest to this list in their respective positions? (Since this is less a list of "Emperors" and more a list of legitimate leaders of the Empire) Thanos6 07:19, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Darth Vader
Was Darth Vader in the time between the Palpatine's death and his own Emperor? If yes, someone should add that...Darth Stassen 16:20, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
- He wasn't. —Grand Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision)
19:21, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
- That would probably be the shortest regin ever... what.... Emperor for five minutes? ;-) KEJ 19:24, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
- He didn't even want to be Emperor. ;) —Grand Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision) 19:26, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
- He didn't even want to be Emperor. ;) —Grand Admiral J. Nebulax (Imperial Holovision)
- That would probably be the shortest regin ever... what.... Emperor for five minutes? ;-) KEJ 19:24, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Carnor Jax?
What's the source for him being Emperor? In Crimson Empire, it's said that Dark Lord Carnor Jax created a special position of power for himself. Also, he is continuously referred to as "Lord Jax" throughout the comic, never Emperor. Is this a retcon, something from Hyperspace, or just fanon? Evir Daal 11:58, 22 March 2007 (UTC)